A series of emails between the three of us, discussing Nettle’s post on Nammu. Coyvere and Nettle thought it would be good background, to show our interactions and how we find consensus on a post. We won’t show it for every post – not every post requires the back-and-forth – but on the more contentious ones.
that sure seems both complex and rather – not sure how to put it – hmmm – off target? for a dragon. I can see that approach working for someone like Danu, especially the plants/herbs, but a dragon? Maybe we need to define ‘dragon’ in this context, so that people don’t think ‘fire breathing, virgin eating, big scaled lizard’. Or automatically think of something like Godzilla. Or somehow Fae. But not sure that bringing up any Infernal links a good idea, if there are any. I’m still at sea about that. How many will automatically assume that Nammu is pure magickal energy? Or is she? Is there actually a physical component? Would incense attract her or is that for us? Pomegranates and dates harken back to when she was a viable Power in the world, but is there anything ‘modern’ that would attract her as well? What about a chant like the Greeks/Romans use, listing her attributes?
Glory, you putz around with dragons as well. I know you don’t have to call them, but if you were to give someone instructions on how to do it, what would you say?
I so love your questions.
I don’t think of dragons as fire breathing virgin-eaters or at least haven’t in the past 5 to 10 years since I started working with Nammu. (Ah yes – her famous quote: humans give me heartburn! Hope) Dragons are primal energy, not lizards. They are connected to that lizard part of our brain so that is where I think people get that lizard idea. Snakes and lizards frighten most of us at our core so I think that is why humans started using the imagery of snakes, lizards, and dragons as ‘bad guys’. Because we have this fear it’s easy to then get people to stop worshipping something that is more alien and less human. It is this collective fear that has given us the image for ‘dragon’. She or other dragons are NOT Godzilla. Like the Fae, theya re working with us, just on an energetic level. How they look physically is and is not what I think of when I picture a dragon in my AD&D mind. It’s more raw energy – I guess more chaotic but not chaos magick. They can, and Nammu will, take on the ‘form’ of a dragon as we picture them in our AD&D minds but that is not their true form. For now, she – like all the deities – are pretty much energy. BUT I’ve never been one to think that the gods are just sitting around a table looking down at us from their astral homes. I’ve always thought of them as energy.
Plants, yes, work for Nammu, or so she says. It is a way for her energy to infuse with someone. The plants or the talisman give her a physical place to hang out. Is she physical in that space? I don’t know. That would be a huge discussion involving physics and such. Does dark matter take up space as we understand it?
You need to explain Infernals to me because I think we might have some confusion over who and what the Infernals are. A language issue.
Incense is both for us and for her. All ritual should connect with people on a multitude of levels, through all our senses – sight, taste, touch, smell, and hearing if you can bring that in. Each person will have one or two senses that work best for them in ritual when it comes to ‘feeling’ or ‘sensing’ deity.
Anything modern that would attract her? I dunno – good question; you ask her, my dear, and see what she says. In my brain she’s rather adamant on the pomegranates, dates, and sparklies.
I don’t do chants. My weakest sense is hearing. I’m good with feeling and smells. If you have a chant for her that would be great. I just don’t, my dear. Truly Glory’s strong point is getting those chants and hearing those poems.
As I said to Glory, we’re a visually oriented species, so we need to be able to ‘see’ something in our minds to assign a name or quality to it. If plants work for Nammu, then your inclusion of plants is a valid way to reach her. If’s not something I ever associated with her, but that’s me.
Infernals, like Tiamat is supposed to be an Infernal, or Lucifer, or Lilith. That sort of thing. I know all the press is bad, and it’s written by their enemies, but even Coyvere is leery of working with them.
If you say she’s adamant about poms and dates and sparklies then I believe you. It fits in with her background.
She, Nammu, helped us become an agricultural based species. Her city, one of the first human cities, was built because of our moving from hunter-gatherers to agrarian society. If that doesn’t scream plants and herbs I’m not sure what else does. Though she wouldn’t mind a tasty chicken or three in your backyard…a goat – she’d really like a goat or a sheep – talk about your Small Farm Goddess!
Hope, YOU are a visually oriented species! Not everyone of us needs to physically see something to feel it or to sense it. I am a smell and feel type – I don’t see things with my eyes. I can kind of see things in my mind but it’s all based on feel or emotions, not actual sight. Everyone’s brain is different and we all interpret the messages we get through our own brain and symbolism.
The Infernals were given a bad rap by Christianity and to a pointy some of that is true. Tiamat is not a gentle goddess. There is very little that is soft about her – she’s kickass, as is Lilith and Lucifer. They all have points in time where we might need to ask them for help. They are all deities that you must be careful of when you ask for something. Is that really so different than asking Loki or Hekate for something? Coyvere is leery and he will admit that because he grew up Catholic he still has some issues. Of the three, Lilith is the one I’m most comfortable working with, then Tiamat – but she can be a bitch – and then Lucifer, but I’m not one who works in the Christian pantheon much.
I was referencing your first post on Nammu. She’s only mentioned that one time, so I didn’t/don’t know what else she did or is responsible for. Small farm goddess – lol!
No, I wasn’t speaking magickally. I mean that our species is primarily visually oriented. We depend upon our vision far more than scent or hearing or touch. Not to say we can’t sharpen the other senses if vision goes missing.
A lot of people have the same religious background as Coyvere and so have some residual nervousness about the Infernals. I only mention it because I don’t know if Nammu is one of them or not, and it might color some people’s perceptions of her. Remember my interactions with the deities is extremely limited.